Path of Exile Questions Thread - August 13, 2020 |
- Questions Thread - August 13, 2020
- The state of this sub
- Bex - "We are very aware that people are keen for deterministic crafting in some form. I’ve discussed this with the team a few times even prior to today’s discussion. While I have no news regarding this, I just wanted to acknowledge that we are aware of this feedback."
- Steel vs a8 sirus in SSFHC china race
- A “Normal” Player’s Perspective on Harvest Not Going Core
- GGG truely broke the game with Harvest
- Steelmage almost dies to Shaper LMP Balls in the China race.
- Empy runs a map with Cutedog that drops more than 1 inventory full of Headhunters
- Being able to incrementally improve gear is good for reducing casual burnout.
- They may have killed our toucan, but this lives on!
- thats pretty cool
- Ventrua rank 1 China league DC rip
- kitava says good morning
- Everyone should watch the Harvest interview with Chris in Baeclast!
- i FOUND this stygian vise
- Will the rework defensive passive nodes come back since harvest is no longer going core?
- I have an addiction, and Harvest league made me realize how bad it was.
- Can we get sextant info when we hit ALT on citadel? (screen attached)
- Suggestion: If you equip the Spirit Guards jewel for ranged Animated Weapons, the Lingering Blades left on the ground by Bladefall should turn into Lingering Bows.
- We should be able to tick which portal skins we want to appear when using the random portal feature.
- Do you think Deterministic Crafting should go to Core? Please explain your answer in Comments.
- Currency exchange bots harrasment
- Big Ballslinger T15 100% Delirium & UE
- I think there is a problem with the way people view difficulty in this game. At least in this subreddit
| Questions Thread - August 13, 2020 Posted: 12 Aug 2020 05:06 PM PDT Questions Thread - August 13, 2020 This is a general question thread on August 13, 2020. You can find the previous question threads here. Remember to check the Wiki first. You can also ask questions in the #any-question channel in our official Discord. The idea is for anyone to be able to ask anything related to PoE:
No question is too big or too small! We encourage experienced players to sort this thread by new. We'd like to thank those who answered questions in the last thread! You guys are the best. [link] [comments]  | ||
| Posted: 13 Aug 2020 08:51 AM PDT
 | ||
| Posted: 13 Aug 2020 12:16 AM PDT
 | ||
| Steel vs a8 sirus in SSFHC china race Posted: 13 Aug 2020 02:11 PM PDT
 | ||
| A “Normal” Player’s Perspective on Harvest Not Going Core Posted: 12 Aug 2020 09:27 PM PDT A forewarning; this is long. I'm not short winded to start, and I have a lot of thoughts on tonight's announcement. I've done my absolute best to present the following as unbiased as possible while trying to capture as much of the perspective as I can from my Discord, other Discords, comments on various streams, community posts, etc.
I'm not a "full-time" PoE player, but I play a LOT. I contribute to the PoE community through build guides and helping out newer players, and I think I've gained a general sense of what a non no-lifer wants from a PoE league.
Bex, Chris, and others at GGG: I consider you the best company in the business. This is all coming from a place of love for PoE and a desire for the game to continue growing and improving.
My premise is as follows, and is what I feel will cause the biggest rift in player response to GGG's announcement: This decision seems to be largely a response to the perfect items attained by the top 0.01% of the PoE playerbase, while leaving new players in a disappointing and uncomfortable position going into the next league.
GGG/Bex Statement 1: "When we designed Harvest, we wanted to experiment with a more deterministic crafting system that would enable players to access powerful items earlier in their character progression. In this sense, we feel that the crafting system has been very successful."
No argument there. Deterministic crafting has enabled players to craft more powerful items earlier on in a league. However, that's not all that deterministic crafting did. Newer players gained the ability to modify their gear, not in a way that spiked their power level through the roof, but in a way that simply allowed them to play the game effectively.
A player that previously spam respawned for 30+ deaths to beat A4 Kaom could now exchange his cold resistance for fire and actually fight the boss. Someone trying out SSF for the first time could work toward adding life rolls to all of their gear without bankrupting their Alteration stash every 8 levels. People that were used to spamming global chats for Act 5 Kitava kills or lab carries could realistically invest time into crafting their own gear that they could wear with pride and actually take on tougher content for themselves.
GGG/Bex Statement 2: "However, at the top end of gameplay, Harvest has made it too easy to gain very powerful items that previously required a lot more work and investment to acquire. This was acceptable for a temporary challenge league but poses problems for the long-term health of Path of Exile's item economy if allowed to remain in its current state."
I believe that it's (hopefully unintentionally) misleading to make this statement without defining "the top end of gameplay". For a HUGE portion of the playerbase, the top end of gameplay would be something along the lines of "consistently killing Sirus at Awakener 8 without using up all of your portals". Even at this level of crafting power, this is out of reach for many players who are either inexperienced or have limited play time.
I've had over a dozen private DMs on Discord and the PoE forums and I'd estimate 50 or more in the main Discord chat channel who've said that this league saw them kill Sirus for the first time. Read that again. Not A8 Sirus. Just Sirus. This is the average PoE player.
Additionally, the terms "work" and "investment" are not a good way to compare Harvest crafting to non-Harvest crafting. It's not like in previous leagues we had Augment Life mods that just took twice the growth cycles to claim. It was literally a crapshoot of random rolls that largely felt inaccessible to anyone without a large starting currency pool to throw at items.
The most recent episode of the Fated Connections podcast is a great example of this issue. Catmaster is talking to Crouching_Tuna, and Tuna describes how an item that he paid a Mirror of Kalandra for in a previous league only cost him 12 Exalts in Harvest because the items in general are so much better. I have no issue with Tuna spending any amount on an item, but 12 Exalts is still an insane amount of currency for a massive portion of the playerbase, and a large amount of people could put together their entire build for that price. Some people could fund their entire league worth of builds on that. That's not a long-term game health issue at all.
98% of the deterministic crafting in Harvest poses ZERO risk to the long term health of PoE's item economy (and I think I might have underestimated by a large amount). I'm not ruining patch 8.14 in 2037 because I have a way to make my own 700 ES chest with triple resists instead of slowly converting my 2,500 Jewellers to Chaos, my Chaos to Exalts, and then messaging someone through an external site for a trade. If anything, it takes significantly more time to farm Harvest crafts than it does to just plug stats into the trade site and send an impersonal message to an unknown seller.
The problem is that you don't see the person who can only play 1-2 hours a day and spends a full week trying to craft that chest. Instead, you see mbXtreme's YouTube video about spending 350+ Exalts and buying 1200+ Remove/Add rolls to make a perfect wand and the conclusion is that Harvest crafting is way too powerful. The reasoning doesn't match up with player reality.
GGG/Bex Statement 3: "Harvest would require a significant amount of rebalancing in order to achieve a healthy level of power for the core game. We would be reassessing the crafting mechanics to determine how many of them we're willing to keep and how much of the remaining crafting would need to be rebalanced...The standard method of adding mechanics to core gameplay where they gain a 10% chance to appear in maps also doesn't really work for Harvest, as it would mean you would only make growth progress in your Sacred Grove every ten maps which would be dissatisfying and slow. We plan to look at an alternate method of providing access to the Harvest mechanic that isn't strictly reliant on RNG but implementing something like this will take a fair amount of time and therefore not be immediate."
I totally understand that making changes to how Harvest functions as a core mechanic may take more time to implement from a technical standpoint. However, is it really that hard to rebalance and imagine how it might work in maps? I've done some board game design before, so I might have a leg up in this situation, but here's just one example that includes both options for rebalancing and map implementation:
There are multiple viable ways to implement Harvest into the core game in a tidy manner.
The Unaddressed Elephant in the Room
My final point is one that I'm maybe most concerned with as we move forward to 3.12, and one that was unaddressed by GGG in the Harvest post. Pardon my language, as I generally try to stay family-friendly, but:
New and casual players who used Harvest league to make PoE both playable and enjoyable without reliance on other people are getting absolutely FUCKED moving forward.
Look at the top comment on the GGG announcement:
GGG, this is the meat and potatoes of your community. These are the people who found Zizaran and Mathil years ago and are now weighing whether or not to purchase supporter packs for 3.12. This is the majority player.
Because I truly think this is so vital, here are a few more of the quotes taken from among the top responses on the GGG post:
In response to the quote above :
I hope that the one thing GGG takes away from this feedback is that by removing deterministic crafting, they're not making it harder to craft; they're making it so most people won't even try.
Is Harvest crafting perfect? No. Is the Grove feasible to re-make each league? HELL NO. However, there are ways to implement deterministic crafting in PoE without risking tanking the economy, devaluing all non-perfect rares, and handing out perfect gear like candy.
I'm not really sure how to end this. Again, I love this game and I want what's best for it. I'm worried, not about the decisions that were made, but about the reasoning behind them. So many players are heavily invested in their crafting projects and characters because they've done it for themselves. I guess I'll end with two final quotes; a comment and response that sums up how many players without hundreds of Twitch viewers and 40 hours a week to play PoE are feeling right now:
[link] [comments]  | ||
| GGG truely broke the game with Harvest Posted: 13 Aug 2020 04:12 AM PDT by giving everyone who played harvest an insight on how bad random based crafting is and how interesting goal driven deterministic crafting is ... PoE will never feel the same way as before when you use a chaos and pray to the RNG gods to get something good, you´ll always remember the seeds or finding a really good item which you want to use, just to notice the resistance is not what you need and you just put it aside, instead of just flipping the resistance and being a happy grinder .. not gonna lie, but i never wanted to play as much as in harvest because having upgrade goals which i could actually plan for (you still had to get seed rng, but it felt better) really really gave me long term goals which i thought i actually could achieve [link] [comments]  | ||
| Steelmage almost dies to Shaper LMP Balls in the China race. Posted: 13 Aug 2020 09:35 AM PDT
 | ||
| Empy runs a map with Cutedog that drops more than 1 inventory full of Headhunters Posted: 13 Aug 2020 10:24 AM PDT
 | ||
| Being able to incrementally improve gear is good for reducing casual burnout. Posted: 13 Aug 2020 10:57 AM PDT Hello; I've been quite busy with real life as of late, so I was not able to play this league. Despite that, I think I would have liked the core idea of this league quite a bit (the ability to incrementally improve gear). I'm a very casual player; in the average league, I'll hop on 2-3 weeks late, get my league start character to level ~85, and then quit after my character has sort of run into a gear improvement wall (not an exp wall at all) after about a week of playing. I've found that I'd play longer (up to around level 91) with certain builds where it was easier to replace gear. Additionally, Delirium League and Betrayal actually stand out in my memory as leagues where gear "improvement" was cheap and could come in smaller increments than normal. But eventually, I'd always quit a league after my league starter's gear basically stopped improving. Burnout for me has never been that my build was too bad to run X or that I got bored of running Strand 50 times in a row—it has always been because I've run out of cool things to do with my build (taken all the juiciest passives already, etc) until I make a couple more ex in order to add 100 eHP and 10% more clear speed to my build. I've seen some other people post about why they like Harvest, and it does personally make me hope that there'll be better ways to incrementally improve gear when I'm next able to play PoE. I'm also a casual noob who takes forever in acts and thus rarely wants to roll multiple characters per league. [link] [comments]  | ||
| They may have killed our toucan, but this lives on! Posted: 13 Aug 2020 08:29 AM PDT
 | ||
| Posted: 13 Aug 2020 03:46 AM PDT
 | ||
| Ventrua rank 1 China league DC rip Posted: 13 Aug 2020 01:20 AM PDT
 | ||
| Posted: 13 Aug 2020 03:49 AM PDT
 | ||
| Everyone should watch the Harvest interview with Chris in Baeclast! Posted: 13 Aug 2020 08:54 AM PDT This interview made VERY CLEAR everything that is being talked about in all this commotion.- That harvest was NEVER going core as is, it is TOO powerful.- They want to rework crafting and used harvest to gather information.- They want to rework rare items and used harvest to gather information.https://youtu.be/FpIB2dMzNu8?t=760 Ziggy: - "You mentioned it need to be hard to craft items, what hard means? Hard in like 100 rolls or the process? What's the part that needs to be hard?"Chirs: - "...I doesn't need to be number of rolls, IDEALLY it's more exciting than just spamming Chaos..." https://youtu.be/FpIB2dMzNu8?t=572 So I'd say calm down... Some form of deterministic craft will come eventually. But be honest, EVERYONE having the same perfect rolled T1 items like Diablo 3 current state makes a weak and boring game, everything is just scale mobs HP and introduce Primal OMEGA Ancient Items to increase even more the Rift number and HP numbers, wow what a boring way of balancing items. Let's not make POE the same. [link] [comments]  | ||
| Posted: 13 Aug 2020 12:03 AM PDT
 | ||
| Will the rework defensive passive nodes come back since harvest is no longer going core? Posted: 12 Aug 2020 11:17 PM PDT Before the league started a thread was posted saying that a lot of defensive nodes were nerfed or gutted. One Bex's replies was that with harvest these wouldnt be a problem and I agree, the remove defence add defence made it easier to get higher tier defence mods. However with determinstic crafting not going core, will these defense nodes come back or reverted to their old values? [link] [comments]  | ||
| I have an addiction, and Harvest league made me realize how bad it was. Posted: 13 Aug 2020 01:05 AM PDT Path of Exile has fed my video game addiction. I will make this as cut and dry as possible, but it will probably devolve into specific gameplay loops that sound like gameplay complaints instead of an overarching commentary on how the game feeds addiction. I have 3 monitors. Leftmost monitor usually has Path of Building open. I spend hours on it thinking up countless builds, forgoing sleep once a many night. When PoB isn't needed, I have Firefox open to look up Blight anointments, the PoE wiki for item and gem information, poeDB for mod information, poe.ninja to look up which builds I shouldn't play, Twitch to have [insert common Poe streamer here] playing in the background to feel less lonely, PoE subreddit to see what hot complaint of the week is, and a PoE profile searcher to look up the random people I play with to see if their build is interesting - all of which are in different tabs. Already, the game commands my full attention without being open. Middle monitor is the game. Rightmost monitor has PoE official discord. On to actual gameplay loop, of which can take anywhere from 1-12 hours. Do maps or whatever. Organize stuff from dump tabs, which can take anywhere from 10-15 minutes. Spam alts, regals, alcs, chaos, what-have-you. Get disappointed when the mods I want don't show up. Rinse, repeat. This goes on for hours because I have no self-control, I'm a perfectionist, and I don't know when to stop. The game doesn't give me a way to get the mods I want to get the perfect item without gambling, so I'm going to get the mods I want the only way I know how - by gambling. Harvest only changes this halfway. There are still mods that can't be added deterministically, like mana, aura, minion, and attribute mods. Being the multi-character builder I am (I made 12 different characters this league, 4 of which are over level 90), I just have to chase the items I want for my special build. I have to build them all. I'm not a good player by any means. I also am not a very organized player. On my worst days, I mindlessly play PoE without really thinking of how to achieve in-game goals. At other times, I try and try to look up game information, only to realize I am now obsessing over the game and its systems without even playing it. After all, I've already spent all that much time theorycrafting and absorbing game knowledge, right? There are people who can play a game, be okay with not having gameplay turn out the way they want, and turn the game off easily and go on with their life. Unfortunately, I am not one of those people. I will obsess and chase that in-game goal, even if it means not performing at utmost efficiency, eating, or sleeping. To the person who searches "addiction" in this subreddit, I hope you have found a story similar to yours. edit: change "how bad it was" to "how bad it is." My addiction is ongoing and not yet resolved. [link] [comments]  | ||
| Can we get sextant info when we hit ALT on citadel? (screen attached) Posted: 13 Aug 2020 05:37 AM PDT
 | ||
| Posted: 13 Aug 2020 12:49 PM PDT | ||
| We should be able to tick which portal skins we want to appear when using the random portal feature. Posted: 13 Aug 2020 09:02 AM PDT We should be able to exclude the portal skins we don't like for our character, and still be able to randomise some portal skins. For example if my character is fire themed, I only want to trigger either Doomcrow Portal and Fire Portal, but disable Ice Portal and Metamorph Portal from the pool of randomised portals. This would allow for more customization. [link] [comments]  | ||
| Do you think Deterministic Crafting should go to Core? Please explain your answer in Comments. Posted: 12 Aug 2020 06:02 PM PDT
 | ||
| Currency exchange bots harrasment Posted: 13 Aug 2020 01:48 AM PDT When I am running low on currency for chisels or sextants I put up trades for chaos exchange at a good price. What I found recently is that a lot of whispers comes through for trades when it happens with random names like u/azvyuf, u/xeeGraSsp , u/euGWVTdmT, u/hrEgQVfeY, u/ASKRHloBk, u/emJIziGhL, u/chongzimeikan and that is a sample after 5min. They whisper, you invite to party, they wait a couple of seconds and then cancel your request. I have sent PM's to each of the above "users" asking them if they were bots, and then offering them ridicilous gear for free (bots not programmed to understand what they are not programmed for), but no reply, so I am 100% certain they were bots (which is why I am not stressed to post them) For a normal player like me we respond to a whisper by quickly going through a portal, then getting trade ready. It seems like what these bots are doing is harassing out any non-bots from partaking in the currency exchange part of the game. My ignore list is growing rapidly now, but I suspect when they make new accounts I would be subject to the same harassment again. So for our normal players that put up trades and you find this happening (for those who listed reasonable currency trades), when a random name whispers you for currency trade, do not go through your portal immediately like I used to do, but ask a random question (maybe one that you stored in clipboard). Most random names would most likely be a bot. I have chosen to stop listing due to this before - which I think was the point in them doing this, but recently I got upset about it and I am thinking of ways to combat this. [link] [comments]  | ||
| Big Ballslinger T15 100% Delirium & UE Posted: 13 Aug 2020 07:30 AM PDT
 | ||
| Posted: 12 Aug 2020 05:07 PM PDT It seems to me that a lot of people on this subreddit feel that this game is "too" grindy for the "Average player". What a lot of people seem to mean by this is that playing the game for enough to do all content and get gear good enough to do all content takes too much effort. I dunno how popular of an opinion this is, but I find this opinion very weird. Sure it makes sense in a sort of surface logic way, play more, get more out of the game. So when you look at streamers making several mirrors in a league it feels easy to blame how much time they spend on the game as a measure of how well they can complete content. However it starts to fall apart when you realize that most streamers are done with their builds in like a few weeks tops, heck Mathil finishes a new build every other week. So it's clearly possible to finish the game to a satisfying degree in a short amount of time. This would also be the point where most people not that mathil plays 6 hours a day and this is his work. However I will not that most people don't make several builds a league. What for mathil takes 2 weeks or less for an average player with the same game knowledge but less time should take maybe 4,5 or even 6 weeks. Personally I don't see the problem with this, a player who plays less *should* take more time to complete the game. However, there are people who somehow think that finishing all endgame content while playing a smaller amount of time (say, 2 hours a day) isn't even possible, to them I would point out a video series by the streamer BalorMage called working class exile, where he did a whole new account with no items given from his other account, and only played just two hours a day, just to see how far he could go in a month. Spoilers, he managed to do all content and finished game rich. So clearly the problem isn't time spent. Most people would also point out that BalorMage has a lot more game knowledge than the average player, and so managed to make the most of his small amount of time. However to them I say, why is this a bad thing? Isn't it the mark of a good difficult game that the people with the most knowledge should be able to reap the most benefit? This is what irks me a lot of the time, people just want to brainlessly power through the game and feel that they are entitled to the best gear cause they should do endgame too. I disagree with this, poe is quintessentially a difficult game, and while I think that it would benefit greatly from BETTER UI AND A BREAKDOWN OF WHAT YOUR CHARACTER ACTUALLY DOES SO WE DON'T HAVE TO USE POB PLEASE GGG. I do however think that the difficulty should stay. Apologies for any weird formatting, I don't post very often. [link] [comments]  |
![[link]](https://i.redd.it/4juoibf3ksg51.png){kind=link}
![[link]](https://i.imgur.com/aQYqviG.png){kind=link}
![[link]](https://i.redd.it/qftw3f6u1rg51.png){kind=link}
![[link]](https://i.redd.it/g4r6cxj92rg51.png){kind=link}
![[link]](https://i.redd.it/h0dvgj5zxpg51.png){kind=link}
![[link]](https://i.redd.it/s9glxj8ilrg51.png){kind=link}
| You are subscribed to email updates from Path of Exile. To stop receiving these emails, you may unsubscribe now. | Email delivery powered by Google |
| Google, 1600 Amphitheatre Parkway, Mountain View, CA 94043, United States | |
No comments:
Post a Comment